(no subject)

[openscarf]

As I listen to the boom-boom celebration of the US's birthday, I don't feel the meaning behind it all, in fact I feel sad and I wonder what Native Americans think of this day.

This country gained independence from the British and claimed a land mass as their own, while ignoring or cheating or moving or killing the indigenous people that lived here. I'm second generation, my grandparents came here from the Middle East to to escape being massacred. Does any country gain independence without steamrolling over another culture and millions of people?

I'm not sure "independence" is the right word for a country. The US isn't under another country's thumb, but financially don't we belong to China?  And aren't the corporations calling all the shots?  And don't we find ourselves in the position of fighting for rights that are being threatened, like woman's health care, social security, a living wage, workers rights, healthy food and water, etc etc etc...?

It seems like once the initial independence is won, it all turns to shit, because the power has simply shifted. Power corrupts, they say. Why do people want it so much? How do I, in my own life, seek power? I don't want to, that's for sure.

I don't believe in nationalism, I think it's racist and ignorant. I'm glad I grew up here but it doesn't make me better than anyone else. There are other countries my people wouldn't have been killed that I could have grown up in. We don't even know where everyone went. Some went to France.

Sure I like fireworks and parties, but I don't know what this day really means anymore. I've outgrown the spin. Most of us believe in the idealism and ideas of this nation, but the US today isn't what Ben and Thomas had in mind, in my opinion.

Comments

[dadadadio.livejournal.com]

I understand your sentiment. Growing up in a former colony, living one mile from the site of the first strike against the British, I take pride in what happened in the 1770's. Breaking free of a foreign power is a big deal.

What happened since then is a different story. American jingoism is not something I'm proud of. Given our liberal democratic ideals, we can do better.

I have nationalist views on some issues. For example, I think we need to take care of our people before we send money overseas, especially our support of corrupt regimes who ignore human rights for their own people.

The world is complicated. It would be a challenge to name one nation, a single race or ethnic group without a stain in their history. Humankind has been in conflict since the first tribes bumped into each other. Every culture has had oppressors and warriors, often in position of power.

America is no better, or worse.

Tonight we watched the fireworks in Tempe. English was a second language where we viewed the festivities. People still flock to America in search of liberty.

That alone is worth celebrating.

[openscarf.livejournal.com]

People come here to escape dire circumstances. It's not the only country they go to, but the US does get the most---from countries that we're occupying and murdering their citizens too, in the name of democracy or oil too.

That sets the bar pretty low in my opinion. This country is failing its own citizens, by design if you ask me, but I'm pretty jaded on the whole mess. I know a lot of people who sure don't want to retire here.

Arizona used to be Mexico, as was Texas and California, I sure hope to hear Spanish being spoken. ;-)

[dadadadio.livejournal.com]

You ane I don't agree on all things political and social, but I think we agree on enough issues to discuss them, even when we don't see eye to eye.

Twenty years ago I considered myself an independent conservative, back when I was a young dad raising a family. I have taken a sharp turn leftward in the last 5-7 years because I too have become jaded.

Sometimes I hate my cynicism, because it makes me feel sooo negative, but the propaganda we're fed from government and corporations sickens me. I too don't want to be brainwashed but I think the machines that wash our brains come from both sides, right and left.

Whenever I get into these political discussions I wish they could be had over a cocktail on a breezy patio. I don't care if we agree or disagree, I almost always learn something when having a chat over adult issues with people who care as much as I do.

Cheers.

One more thing.

[dadadadio.livejournal.com]

I was not complaining about hearing Spanish. Have you seen Alexandra Pelosi's documentary 'Citizen USA'? I brought a tear to my eye seeing the wonderful people flocking to America in love with what this nation stands for.

I wish the USA was actually as great as they think it is and I hope more people like them can help us make it so.

Re: One more thing.

[openscarf.livejournal.com]

I know you weren't complaining and I hope my emoticons softened my words a little. I don't mean to argue against you, I'm just ranting here about what I see and believe. I have a good sense about these things. ;-)

I think America's in for a new phase. A country must be judged by the health and quality of living of it's citizens and I'm sure you know the stats regarding healthcare, joblessness, inflation, corporate rule over elected officials, wallstreet, education cuts, poverty, etc. I guess it's the hideous consequence of capitalism, that's why I decided by force and then sense to consume as little as possible and as much second hand as possible. I even dream about going off the grid, there's lots of people, alternate cultures out there. I want to, in any way that's possible, to wash my brain of the same old same old.

The TV news and much of printed news is just bs propaganda, spoon-fed to the journalists, their paycheck signed by one corporate entity or another.

I think the "USA" is an emotion, we are just like the people in every other country, and at the mercy of who ever sits in the big house. Luckily our times are still ok, but they're hacking away at our liberties as we speak. I guess I'm really liberal because I see no bias in how I think and believe. hahahhahaha!!

For how many years have we propped up brutal regimes, only to see their citizens come here, legally or illegally?

I'm much more jaded than you. I don't get sentimental for what this country stands for. I know why people come here, my grandparents did, I have friends who were smuggled over the Mexican border from El Salvador, I know all that. It's hard for them. It's not like you step on this land and red white and blue lights are shooting out of your arse! LOL They're glad to be alive and safe, they're not going to bad mouth their new country but their hearts are usually broken for leaving how they did.

And we cannot forget the Native Americans.

There's a great article going around about a young journalist who never became documented. Did you read that? I'll dig it up for you if you didn't.

Well, I'm not going to do any yoga. I'm going to get a glass of wine, I agree, too bad we're not floating in the pool or sitting on cool patio watching the fog roll in, solving the world's problems! :-)

Re: One more thing.

[dadadadio.livejournal.com]

Whenever I rant about injustice, corruption, or some other pet peeve my son's would say, "The world would surely be different if dad were in charge."

I'll pass that on to you. The world be certainly be different if Cynthia were in charge.

We're all biased towards our unique life journey, the people we encounter along the way, hardships, triumphs and how they shape our views. I have learned EVERYTHING is subject to change. One unexpected turn in life can alter our perception of our world. And I know you know that.

Yes, I love the story of Jose Antonio Vargas. He represents the side of immigration, legal or not, many people fail to see. He's a good kid, intelligent, trying to make good in his life. This is why the Citizen USA doc is so good. There are many people like him. The word immigrant has been stained by negative stereotypes that must be corrected by educated immigrants coming forward, as Vargas did.

Off the grid sounds great .... if I didn't need a job.

Re: One more thing.

[openscarf.livejournal.com]

I think you don't step off until you get things in order. I'll have to go watch a documentary and learn how. LOL

[yummydeb.livejournal.com]

Does any country gain independence without steamrolling over another culture and millions of people?

I doubt it. And the 'winners' always are the ones who write history, generally turning it into RAH RAH WE ROCK. :-(

Nationalism makes me nuts. I don't like it at ALL, and I've always hated patriotic flag waving (in any country). I love what American could be and despair over what it is/has become.

I often wonder what the Founding Fathers would think...

[openscarf.livejournal.com]

Really! We have to search and study to learn the whole history of each "segment" we were taught in school don't we? I'm still surprised when I learn something new about "history." I don't like being brainwashed.

Men and their pissing contests!! (Sorry good intelligent men friends out there) :-)

[dadadadio.livejournal.com]

The "What would our founding fathers think?" question has been asked many times and the answers usually conform with the ideology of the person answering. In many cases right wingers and lefties see the founders in the same light as they see themselves.

As a native of New England and one who loves our revolutionary history, I loathe the use of Tea Party by the right wing. I believe they've completely missed the point of what happened in Boston and the colonies.